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 What the heck is Hell?

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design219
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PostSubject: What the heck is Hell?   Tue May 20, 2008 2:39 pm



Does anyone believe in it? And if so, what do you think it is?

My wife thinks hell is the absence of God. I like that definition.

I'm no Bible scholar, but I've heard that there is much disagreement among them about where the Bible stands on the subject. Also, is it true that most of popular culture's view of hell is based on texts that didn't make the final Bible cut?
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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Tue May 20, 2008 3:22 pm

The Bible is actually very clear on what hell is. Its the people who want to spiritualize and lesson what it truly is.

We know from the Bible its
Hell was designed originally for Satan and his demons (Matthew 25:41; Revelation 20:10).

Hell will also punish the sin of those who reject Christ (Matthew 13:41,50; Revelation 20:11-15; 21:Cool.

Hell is conscious torment.
Matthew 13:50 “furnace of fire…weeping and gnashing of teeth”
Mark 9:48 “where their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched”
Revelation 14:10 “he will be tormented with fire and brimstone”

Hell is eternal and irreversible.
Revelation 14:11 “the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever and they have no rest day and night”
Revelation 20:14 “This is the second death, the lake of fire”
Revelation 20:15 “If anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire”

There are many other passages in the Bible that describe hell, I pulled these quickly from the bible.org.

There are some Christians that deny that God could ever create Hell and if he did, its not as bad as the Bible say.

Ultimately its a place for people and angels that have rebelled and rejected God. Looking at it from another angle, why should people go to heaven if they spent their lives rejecting God and his offer of salvation. With any decision there is a consequence (good or bad). God has written the good and bad consequences, he does not want anyone to go to hell but people themselves make the decision since he gave us free will.
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design219
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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Tue May 20, 2008 3:26 pm

So, do people who have never heard of the Christian God go to hell?
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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Tue May 20, 2008 4:03 pm

Quote :
So, do people who have never heard of the Christian God go to hell?
absolutely.

the thing is we all deserve it so its only by grace we dont go there...

however thats not the whole story... thats a depressing God.

the whole story is, God created us to not die, and not experience pain and to have a perfect communion with him. WE're the ones who chose to sin. and because of that sin man is destined to die.

however, almost immediately after sin and death and pain entered into the world God layed out his redemptive plan (gen 3:15), and thanks to his plan being fulfilled in Christ, we now have a chance to enter back into that perfect communion with our God. While on earth it wont be perfect, but it will be partial and good. After death in heaven thats when we will enter into that perfect communion and there we wont even have the option of screwing it up.

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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Tue May 20, 2008 8:22 pm

design219 wrote:
So, do people who have never heard of the Christian God go to hell?

Well first off let me say that this. There are a lot of things we do not about God's plan. We can only base what we know from the Bible. Going away from the Bible leads us into heresy and error.

With that said there are a few scriptures that address this, such as Roman's 1:19 and 20
"since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them."
and version 20
"For since the creation of the world Godís invisible qualitiesóhis eternal power and divine natureóhave been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse."

So it seems that God in his infinite wisdom, has accounted for people who have yet heard about his Son's payment of of sin, by his death and resurrection.

Is this you're answer you're looking for? Probably not as fulfilling as you had hoped, I suspect. Basically if people reject God and decide to live life the way they want to, they will have no excuse before the great white throne, regardless if they have head about Jesus. God is not interested in sending people to hell, quite the contrary.

Think about it this way, he set a plan in motion before the creation of the world and man to become man, live a sinless life and then suffer a horrendous death (and affirmed that it was sufficient by his resurrection) so that we may have fellowship with him. That does sound like an act of an intelligent being wanting to send people to hell. Those people who decide to reject that however will end up there.
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design219
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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Wed May 21, 2008 6:06 pm

rogermugs wrote:
Quote :
So, do people who have never heard of the Christian God go to hell?
absolutely.

Well I absolutely don't buy that. A god that does that is evil.
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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Wed May 21, 2008 6:38 pm

did you read the rest of what I said?

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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Wed May 21, 2008 7:25 pm

Yeah, did I miss something?

You are saying you have to be a Christian to avoid hell, right?

You also say "we're the one's that choose to sin". Well, I don't know about most people, but I try not to. Nobody is perfect, but most of us are certainly not evil, and I haven't done anything to deserve an eternity in hell.

And that leads to the definition of "sin". As stated in another thread, some would say having a beer is a sin. Some think having more than one wife is a sin. Some think supporting the death penalty is a sin. Who decides these things?
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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Wed May 21, 2008 7:46 pm

the deal is that none of it matters.

all that matters is that we have sinned. If we were perfect we'd get into heaven on our own merit and wouldn't need the Lord.

we do all try to not sin, but God is a perfect God who demands perfection. the thing is, he created us in a world where it was nearly impossible to sin, we would have been happy there a long time had adam and eve not eaten the apple.

once we've sinned once in the eyes of a God who demands perfection we are no longer perfect, and he says that deserves death, and even eternal damnation (he doesn't want us going there, we chose it). But again, in his love he provided a way for us to be deemed perfect (just through faith in his son), and all we have to do is choose it again.
seems easy enuf to me.

but its not just about avoiding hell. If you dont know christ then you'll never know real fulfillment in this life either. You may have temporary joys etc... but real fulfillment only comes in this life through a relationship with our God.

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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Wed May 21, 2008 8:03 pm

rogermugs wrote:
once we've sinned once in the eyes of a God who demands perfection we are no longer perfect, and he says that deserves death, and even eternal damnation (he doesn't want us going there, we chose it). But again, in his love he provided a way for us to be deemed perfect (just through faith in his son), and all we have to do is choose it again.

Bizarre.

That doesn't sound like a fair play for the thousands of poor souls who have just left this earth under rubble in China. Most of them never heard of Jesus, so how are they supposed to choose Him?

So God thinks we deserve eternal damnation because we are not perfect? No way, sorry, how can you believe this?
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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Wed May 21, 2008 8:04 pm

design219 wrote:
...and I haven't done anything to deserve an eternity in hell.
You've hit the crux there. Christians believe that all of humanity deserves hell. Only by accepting the sacrificial death of Jesus on the cross, as atonement for one's sin, can a person be saved from being damned to hell. So basically, all are guilty as charged, and the only way to avoid punishment is to accept the death of another in one's place. I doubt any of us truly understand the nature of heaven or hell, but I hope this helps a little bit.

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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Wed May 21, 2008 9:38 pm

design219 wrote:


Bizarre.

That doesn't sound like a fair play for the thousands of poor souls who have just left this earth under rubble in China. Most of them never heard of Jesus, so how are they supposed to choose Him?

Thats why if you're a real believer you have to be pretty die hard about missions. Thats why there are thousands of missionaries there right now. And thats why a christian is stuck in this dilemma where we WANT to tell you about jesus because we genuinely believe you dont have a chance if you dont hear about him, but in our modern time sharing faith about jesus is offensive. We'd rather be offensive and give you a chance then have you die without having had a chance.

do you understand how even if you dont agree with chrisitianity we are so serious about evangelism?

design219 wrote:

So God thinks we deserve eternal damnation because we are not perfect? No way, sorry, how can you believe this?

ditto nathan.
again, he offered us a way to be regarded as perfect, through jesus. Then he'll look on Jesus' perfection instead of our stain.

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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Wed May 21, 2008 10:27 pm

Guys, you're dancing around the issue. How can a loving God commit souls to eternal damnation because they didn't follow a plan they never heard?

And I understand the evangelistic nature of Christianity, but I don't like it. It reminds me of the Borg from Star Trek... "assimilate or die" type of thing. I believe there are many paths through life.
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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Wed May 21, 2008 10:33 pm

design.
Where do you think people should go when the die? And on what do believe should people be judged before a righteous God? Merit? If good outweighs bad or what?

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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Wed May 21, 2008 10:42 pm

rogermugs wrote:
design.
Where do you think people should go when the die? And on what do believe should people be judged before a righteous God? Merit? If good outweighs bad or what?

I'll answer yours if you'll answer mine. Smile

I personally don't think there is an afterlife, but again I will not say I'm sure as the is no way of knowing anything for certain. I think people are the sum of their life, decisions and actions, and only they can judge themselves.

I wish more people would chime in on this subject, I find it very interesting.
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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Thu May 22, 2008 7:31 am

design219 wrote:
So, do people who have never heard of the Christian God go to hell?
Revelation 5:9; And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation...

This suggests that people of every kindred, tongue, peoples, and nations are found worthy of the Book of Life. I think Christians often mistake the "good" news of the gospel for the "bad". It is not for us to judge who should go to heaven or hell either way, but to bring the good news to others.

Romans 4:15; Because the law worketh wrath: for where no law is, there is no transgression.
Luke 19:37-40; And when he was come nigh, even now at the descent of the mount of Olives, the whole multitude of the disciples began to rejoice and praise God with a loud voice for all the mighty works that they had seen; Saying, Blessed be the King that cometh in the name of the Lord: peace in heaven, and glory in the highest. And some of the Pharisees from among the multitude said unto him, Master, rebuke thy disciples.
And he answered and said unto them, I tell you that, if these should hold their peace, the stones would immediately cry out.


These passages suggest that A. Where there is no law, there is no transgression, but B. Even if the good news is not brought to them, they will be told otherwise, and C. those of every peoples will be in heaven.

I believe God is just regardless of whether or not we fully understand His nature.
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PostSubject: Re: What the heck is Hell?   Thu May 22, 2008 7:58 am

Thanks ebuddy. I've never heard that interpretation before.
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